John: Welcome to the first edition of For Love or Money in 2006 and the fifteenth edition overall. The first six questions will deal with current topics in WWE followed by two TNA questions and then the final two questions will be our usual "classic" questions talking about things from the past. Then we'll wrap it up with some Quick Hits. Think of it like a written version of Pardon the Interruption, the hit ESPN sports talk show program featuring Mike Wilbon on Tony Kornheiser. Not exactly like that, obviously, but loosely based on it.
Matt chose the odd numbered questions because he's odd while John chose the even numbered ones because he's not odd.
1. Where do you see the WWE title picture heading into Wrestlemania?
Matt: Hopefully with Edge going in as champion. His reign has been an excellent change of pace. It's the first heel champion on Raw other than Triple H since the Undisputed Title was split (I don't count Orton's less than 24-hour heel reign), and the television has been much more exciting since he's had the belt. The main event picture is outstanding. Unfortunately, the fact that he's still kept the spinner belt has me leery that they're going to give the belt right back to Cena at the Rumble, and have Hunter challenge at Mania. It's a scenario I don't want to see at all, but I think it's fairly likely.
John: I'm leaning towards a triple threat match now with Edge defending against HHH and Cena. Just seems like this the direction it's headed with HHH being reluctant to team with Edge causing tension there, Cena still being the clear top babyface on Raw and probably in the main event match at WrestleMania again. I wouldn't mind Cena vs. HHH at all largely because it's fresh and with the right build I trust those guys to make it special.
Matt: The title picture around Wrestlemania is a double-edged sword, I feel. On one hand, it's nice to not have a predictable main event that we call around this time. But at the same time, I'm nervous to see what they actually pull off. You have to figure it's some combination of Edge, Cena and Hunter, if not all three.
John: Yeah, like you said it's nice not knowing, but I'm worried that WWE doesn't even know at this point too. And that's a problem. Personally, I dislike triple threat matches as main events. I guess it worked for WM20, but if that was just Benoit vs. HHH with the same ending I think we'd all be just as satisfied. Question is, do you think Edge is leaving the Rumble as champion?
Matt: Yes, I do. I don't know if he'll make it to Mania as champion, though. They might have a title change on Raw (RARE!) but Edge is doing too good of a job as champion right now for them to give it back to Cena.
John: As I say all the time, Cena is WAY more interesting as a challenger than he was as a champion. Another point to bring up is where does Flair fit into all this? Is it that far fetched to consider Ric Flair being in a WWE Title match at Mania? Maybe it could be a four way or even Flair vs. Edge one on one with HHH vs. Cena also on the card. I'm not crazy, am I?
Matt: I don't think so. I mean, they never *really* ended the Hunter/Flair feud then, did they? Hunter said he put Flair down, but Flair was back within a month. If I was WWE I wouldn't push my luck though. They got lucky with the Triple Threat because it was MSG and it was Benoit. The Fatal Four Way back in 2000 was a disaster.
John: I think Edge retains at the Rumble, carries the belt into Mania, HHH wins it there and they do Cena vs. HHH over the spring and summer when they will need a fresh program to garner good PPV numbers.
2. We had this question in our forums, but I want to discuss it more. Who will be a World Champion first: Chris Masters or Carlito?
John: It's Masters. He's taller, has more muscles and really, it ends there. Carlito has more all around talent, but we know this is WWE and that doesn't mean that much in the long run. So I think Masters will get it. I don't even know if Carlito will ever get it. They're both young, though, so there's plenty of time. No need to rush either guy in that spot this year, but I think by next year at least one of them will be ready.
Matt: Masters, unfortunately. Even though I think Carlito has a better character, better look and better in-ring work, the suits seem to have this gigantic hard-on for Masters. They gave him an unstoppable finisher and they book him like he's a God. It's not going to happen for a while, but I think they'll give Masters the belt eventually.
John: So we agree on Masters. I thought we would. I sure hope it's not this year though because I don't think he's ready. However, with another year of seasoning and more matches under his belt I see him getting better. The positive with him is he seems to work really hard, he moves around the ring okay and as long as he has that willingness to get better he should be alright in the long run.
Matt: When it comes to heel champions on Raw, though, it's pretty much impossible to win a title. I'm still surprised as hell that they gave the belt to Edge. I was sure Cena was going to hold on to it until he dropped to Hunter. Really, the best chance either guy has of being champion is if they end up on Smackdown and go after the World title. Carlito has already been on Smackdown, Masters hasn't. That's why I think Masters might jump over, and his chances of being a World Champion will improve drastically.
John: I don't know if Carlito is ever going to be a world champion. In the forums I'm pretty sure he won that poll and it surprised the hell out of me. Dude is short. He's not that well built. Personally I don't mind that, but it's Vince McMahon and we all know he's horny for the big guys.
Matt: Carlito's a wonderful entertainer and talented as all hell, and should have a lot of staying power. He reminds me a lot of Edge back when he debuted in terms of how solid he was. But how long did it take Edge to win a World Title? Seven and a half years! You never know, Carlito's number might be called, but it won't be for a while.
John: Carlito reminds me more of Christian than Edge simply because he's short like Christian is. Edge is 6'4" so he was always one of those guys that had a shot at being champion. Not saying he doesn't deserve it, but in McMahon's world all these little things that shouldn't matter really do matter.
Matt: If you're good enough, and the crowd takes to you enough, you'll be champion. Look at Benoit, Jericho and Eddie.
John: And how long were Benoit and Eddie wrestling before they were champs? Over 15 years each. My point is made.
3. Shelton's Momma: Good idea or bad idea?
Matt: Good idea. In fact, it's probably the most successful out of all the "dumb" things the writing team has done. Even though it's so stereotypical, it's also hilarious. And it's getting Shelton more TV exposure than his freakin' 8-month-long run with the IC title! So I'm all for it. I'd just like to see it have a feud tacked on to it so we can really see where it goes.
John: I love it. The last six months of 2005 was really sad for Benjamin. He was barely doing anything on the shows. When I read about how they were looking for a woman to play his mom I was actually excited because at least that meant they remembered he was on the payroll. In a perfect world his feud with Michaels would be heating up majorly right now, he would have turned vicious heel on him and they would have a terrific match at WrestleMania. That's not happening, but hopefully he gets an angle for Mania and finds his way on the card to try to steal the show like he did last year.
Matt: I'm surprised you LOVE Shelton's momma. I think we may have 2006's version of Al Wilson here!
John: Whoa, let's not get crazy here. Nobody compares to the Charismatic Enigma (sorry Jeff Hardy) known as Big Al. Yes, I said big, ask Dawn Marie. Shelton's momma is pretty damn hilarious and unlike most people on wrestling shows she is a good actress too. That helps.
Matt: I mean, it's typical WWE tripe. But it's still fresh. It won't be, however, if Shelton doesn't get a storyline/feud.
John: Man, I was so hoping for Michaels/Benjamin going into Mania like the Jericho/Michaels thing a few years back. Now, who knows what Shelton is going to be doing there.
Matt: Probably another Money in the Bank, interpromotional I'm thinking.
John: That was my idea in my Rumbling to Mania column, but we'll see if that happens.
4. Did they make the right call in how they ended the Best of 7 US Title series or should they have waited for Booker to be healthy to at least wrestle the seventh match?
John: Here's the thing. Booker was hurt. Fine. I understand that. However, he's cleared to wrestle by the time the Rumble happens, so after the series in tied 3-3 why not wait a couple of weeks to have the seventh match on the undercard at the Rumble? Give 'em twenty minutes, make it memorable and let them put a capper on a strong series of matches. At least they tried to salvage it with Booker owing Orton a favor, but it still doesn’t help the credibility of that belt.
Matt: I think so. I mean, Benoit and Booker were doing such a good job, but injuries are just a part of being a wrestler. Obviously, it sucks, added on top of the 1500 other injuries that have plagued Smackdown, but what can ya do? It brought forth a nice storyline of Booker having to owe Orton bigtime. Orton may cash in on his favor sometime down the line. And we got some decent matches out of Benoit and Orton. Also, I'm sure Benoit will get a shot at Booker when Book is healthy enough. Enough is enough though. It was time for them to start building the United States title. I don't think waiting for Booker to heal would have been a good move.
John: I think you're too impatient about the US Title. The matches with Booker and Benoit were strong. Then they had to protect Orton so much by having him lose by DQ twice and it cheapened the series big time. Then the third match with Orton-Benoit and last in the series had so many run-ins and crap going on that it didn't elevate the US Title at all. It cheapened it, which is a shame. Booker's cleared for the Rumble. Should have done match number seven there.
Matt: I don't know about Match Number 7, but a Booker/Benoit match should have happened at the Rumble. It's too bad that Smackdown's roster is so thin right now that they needed both Benoit and Booker in the Rumble match itself. And Booker may be cleared, but not enough to wrestle a full match. I have a feeling his Rumble performance is going to be VERY limited this year.
John: You're a doctor now? I think he'd be fine. On the plus side, this "favor" thing with Orton/Booker could turn out to be interesting. Of course it could be suck, but I tend to be an optimistic person about these things.
Matt: That's you. Always Mr. Positive.
5. Is Chavo Guerrero main event material?
Matt: Absolutely. And I'm not saying that just because of the whole Eddie thing. Yeah, Eddie is a huge reason why Chavo's getting the push and reactions he's getting, but people are actually happy to see HIM. There are a lot of "Let's Go Chavo" chants when he wrestles. I think with the right storyline, people would actually care about him as a headliner. To start, I would actually like to see him involved in a feud with Chris Masters. After all, he didn't succumb to the Masterlock a couple weeks ago when they were playing Beat the Clock.
John: Nah. I like him. I think he's a good talent that knows how to have good matches with just about everybody, but he's not at that elite level. His height doesn't help either. Obviously other guys his height have had success, but you can't compare him to a Rey or an Eddie. He's not at their level. I wouldn't mind seeing him with the IC title, but at this point he has yet to even have a storyline on Raw, so who knows if they think that highly of him.
Matt: I think you're correct about Chavo not being at that elite level, but he's just about there. He's solid as hell. And they don't have a storyline for him because as you said, they can only really push one babyface at a time. But the people love him, and you can't deny the voice of the people for so long. How do you think Matt Hardy got rehired?
John: Matt Hardy's still employed? He's being used to put over a 45 year old Finlay. Great use. Anyway, I like Chavo Guerrero a lot as a wrestler and as a person. I think he deserves opportunities to show what he can do in the ring. I think he can teach a lot of the young wrestlers on Raw how to work, specifically a guy like Carlito. That doesn't mean main event, though. I think you're reaching a little too much, man.
Matt: Depends on what you mean by main event. Is it title matches? Not really. But I consider Calrito and Masters "main event" wrestlers because they're prominently featured, and take part in TV main events. Chavo could be that, easily.
John: I don't think he's even been in that many TV main events in his career. I think what Chavo's best suited for is being a valued midcard veteran wrestler. Maybe an IC champion. Last I checked, that belt isn't getting main event matches on Raw either. Flair is, but they barely recognize the belt. I wouldn't complain about the Chavo push. I just don't see it happening.
6. Ric Flair is 56 years old, he bleeds weekly and he just killed himself in a TLC match. How long is he going to wrestle and at what age will he finally retire?
John: I think he's got another couple of years left in him. I am worried for the guy, though. I swear after that TLC match when I came on the net I kept thing I'd be reading some Flair injury update. I don't know how, at that age, he can take that much punishment, lose that much blood regularly and still do this stuff. My dad's in his late '60s now, is a very fit man, always has been and he complains about all his aches all the time. Not because he's a whiner, but because he's old. Some wrestlers just don't know when to slow down. Flair is one of them. I don't see him stopping this year. He's got another year left at least.
Matt: I've kinda got two answers. The first is that he'll wrestle until he can't do it anymore. He loves it, and apparently because of his divorce, he needs it to make a living. But just from the way he's being treated lately, it looks like this is a farewell tour for Ric. It may end at Mania, it may end at Summerslam, but I think Flair might retire from full-time competition sometime this year.
John: I don't see Flair retiring this year. From interviews and other comments I've seen from him he seems intent on going at it another couple years or so. Then again, in his book he wrote so glowingly about how great his family life is, then like a year later you hear about all this bad stuff with him and his wife. I don't think Flair has a plan. He's just going to go for as long as he can without sustaining a major injury.
Matt: Not that I'm complaining. He doesn't look so hot, but he can still go. And if you can still go, I want you on my TV.
John: When I'm 56 I'll be retired, living in Vegas, playing poker at night, golf in the day and what happens in Vegas will stay there. And no Matt, you can't visit.
Matt: I'll probably be dead of a heart attack. Too much stress from having to carry you every other month.
John: Maybe it's because you're 21 and Sober. I mean liquored up and high.
Matt: I've been clean for 10 hours now. That's progress.
7. Did TNA shoot themselves in the foot with the Sting deal, or was it a good move?
Matt: I think they shot themselves in the foot, yes. Sting does NOT have that crossover appeal, nor do I think he ever did. Right now, I believe if you're a wrestling fan and you know who Sting is, then you also know what TNA is. Sting isn't going to draw for them. They gave him a huge contract, they're already giving him vacation time, and in the meanwhile, other stars are starting to look at his contract and go "Hey, what gives?" I've heard rumblings that Samoa Joe isn't really happy about it. Contracts like Sting got should have been reserved for somebody like a Goldberg or a Rock, if they could manage a coup to pick either one of them up. Sting won't make a lick of difference.
John: Too much money paid and they're not getting that much work out of him. I don't understand it. It's not like he has the appeal of an Austin or Rock. Yes, there were times when he drew well, particularly the Hogan feud in 1997, but that's almost a decade ago and was largely based on how strong the nWo was as a draw at that time. Throw in the fact that he's going to be 47 years old this year and it makes you wonder what they are thinking. They want to push this new and exciting product, which it is at times, yet they bring in a guy who hasn't been a full-timer in about six years? The positive of Sting is he's not a complainer and should provide leadership. I just don't know if that's enough to like the move.
Matt: Keep in mind that I'm not blaming Sting for any of this. He was presented with this incredible deal. What would you expect him to say? Sorry, for the good of the business I'm going to pass this up? Bullshit. I'd take that deal if were him without hesitation. I'm mad at TNA management for offering it to him. TNA is supposed to be this alternative, and they've got some great talent that could actually make their program watchable enough to compete with what WWE has, and they fucked it up by bringing in Sting, who will not be worth what they're paying him. Not even close.
John: Once they do the Sting/Jarrett program it'll be like WCW was in the Hogan years with shitty main event programs that aren't that interesting with tremendous undercard matches because the talent at that level is so good. I'm sorta interested in Jarrett/Christian although I think if Christian wins he'll just drop it back to Jarrett for when Sting comes back, so it'll be a shitty reign if it happens. I don't want to see Jarrett vs. Sting. Hell, I'm a Sting fan, but I don't think he should be wrestling "full time" these days. Like you said, not his fault he said yes. It's just TNA making a mistake by offering that much.
Matt: It's actually amusing that TNA is making this such a big deal when they ALREADY brought him in. I guess they have just forgotten everything that happend in the "four-sided ring" days.
John: Yeah, it'll change the course of professional wrestling. It's got a better chance of setting it back.
8. Who do you feel is the best performer in TNA right now?
John: Samoa Joe. He has great talent in the ring, the kind of aura around him that nobody in TNA has right now and in a perfect world he'd be main eventing PPVs in a month or two. Too bad Jarrett is around. I'd much rather see Joe vs. Christian in a few weeks instead of Jarrett, but we all know that's not happening. I think after Joe, AJ Styles has to be acknowledged for being continually awesome and elevating everybody he works with. He's one of my five favorite performers in all of wrestling. Also want to acknowledge Christian Cage, who has really came in there as a house on fire.
Matt: Samoa Joe, easily. They're booking him quite well. He's getting that Goldberg-like push by making him absolutely unstoppable, but the difference between him and Goldberg is that they're not just constantly feeding him jobber fodder. He's getting big wins over guys like AJ Styles and Christopher Daniels. It certainly helps matters that he's a maniac in the ring. I hope he becomes World Champ over there eventually.
John: Samoa Joe should be World Champion in TNA by March. I don't see it happening, though. Jeff Jarrett is still the main booker there and as long as that's the case he's going to keep the belt on himself. Jeff, you're pushing 40. You're slow. Your matches bore the fuck out of me. You book ten run-ins every time you lose to protect yourself. Get over it. Let somebody else have a shot, especially because they deserve it.
Matt: Yeah. I can't even make a case for him at all. This isn't "internet dirtsheet negativity." Jeff Jarrett is horrible. No self-respecting booker who wasn't involved with the program would give him these title runs. Samoa Joe will be the revitalization of TNA much like Goldberg was with WCW back in 98 until they fucked it up with Hogan and Nash. Given the ball, Joe will do to TNA what he did to ROH.
John: Gotta talk about Christian a bit because frankly he's done awesome work in TNA since going there. His promos have been exceptional. He's always been a good talker, but you can see how excited he is to be there and have a future. AJ Styles also is one of my favorites. Never has bad matches. Always makes me say "wow" when he's in the ring and is the definition of a entertaining pro wrestler.
Matt: It's funny. I like Styles in TNA but I'm not as big of a fan of him in ROH. TNA to me seems fast-paced and high-impact, and that's what AJ Styles encompasses. And yes, Christian has been phenomenal since coming to TNA (no pun intended to Styles).
9. It's Royal Rumble time. What was your all-time favorite Rumble elimination?
Matt: Bushwacker Luke in 1991. He does his little Bushwacker thing down the aisle, walks in the ring from one side to the other, where Earthquake throws him off, and he continues his Bushwacker walk all the way to the back as if nothing happened. Hilarious.
John: Probably Taka Michinoku in 2000. I think it was 2000. Even though it looked painful as hell when he landed right on his face and they replayed it like five times it was a favorite in terms of how memorable it was. Of course, Benoit eliminating Big Show in 2004 was a huge highlight as well.
Matt: Haha. Taka was brutal. They showed that in slow motion. I mean, it would be a LOT more funny if he didn't get a separated shoulder from it, but it still was mildly amusing.
John: One of those things I'll never forget. It was disgusting. I feel bad for laughing because the guy got hurt, but you know deep down he probably thought it was cool too. Props to Paul London last year on the Snitsky clothesline on the apron.
Matt: Oh lord, that was nasty. And for what? To put that sack of crap over, London had to die?
John: That Bushwacker thing you mentioned was fucking hilarious too. I think Lawler went in the Rumble in 97, Bret threw him out and he went back to annoucning. That was funny as well. The Cat in 2004 was hilarious too mainly because Tazz sings his theme song during it
Matt: Oh yeah! Lawler said "It takes a king...." goes in, gets eliminated, then goes back outside and says, "...to know a king." The Rumble has always been good for some comedy moments. Drew Carey comes to mind.
John: I liked Hassan last year too. Everybody just stops fighting, looks at him and beats the crap out of him. Crowd is loving every second of it. That was classic
Matt: I don't know how many funny moments will be in this year's Rumble. Maybe Shaq will eliminate Carlito, but that'll be it.
John: They're always good for a couple every year. I enjoy the Rumble for stuff like that.
10. Everybody talks about what the best Rumble ever was. But what about the worst Rumble(s) ever, booking wise and execution wise?
John: I thought 1993's Rumble sucked pretty bad with Yokozuna winning it. 1992 was the best ever, then they followed it up with this garbage. The only thing I remember from it was how great the Perfect/Flair exchange was with Perfect taking him out because Flair was leaving WWF soon after that. Just seemed like one of those nothing happening Rumbles.
Matt: 1994. That whole Pay Per View sucked. From the "Resurrection" of the Undertaker to the Rumble itself, it was poorly booked and executed. There was little-to-no star power in the Rumble match itself, and they did a cop out by having both Bret and Lex win. I was a huge mark back then, and had seen every show from Wrestlemania 7 in 1991 until then, and I remember clearly that that was the first Pay Per View when I went, "Wow, that sucked."
John: I think we can both agree that the mid 90s sucked and the two events we picked were from that era. Hell, you could even look at 1995 and 1996 as bad Rumbles too. Only thing that saved them was I loved HBK and it was great to see him win. One of those years it was only a thirty minute Rumble and the roster was so thin it was pretty embarrassing to watch.
Matt: That would be 95. Yeah, Shawn going coast to coast was impressive...but Benoit nearly doubled the time spent in the Rumble in 04. At least the ending to 95 was thrilling, and we had a happy ending in 96. 94 was a thin roster, and the ending was fucked up.
John: Oh come on, you loved the Lex Express.
Matt: I don't have anything more to say to that.
QUICK HITS
Matt: I know we're all upset over the untimely release of Heidenreich. What was your favorite Heidy moment?
John: I know you're going with raping Michael Cole because you're jealous of Heidenreich, so I'll just say the general arm swinging during his music. That was just so catchy.
Matt: I was actually going with the Snitsky/Heidenreich vignettes. They were 50% homoerotic, 50% creepy 100% hilarious.
John: You loved them like the Lex Express.
John: We touched on this earlier, but are you in favor of a WrestleMania 6 person Money in the Bank ladder match again?
Matt: Yeah, interpromotional. With Benoit, Hardy and JBL on the Smackdown side, and Shelton, RVD and Kane on the Raw side.
John: Do it with three from Raw and three from Smackdown. Put some high fliers in. Hell, throw Kane in there again so he can push people around too. It was fun last year.
Matt: Spirit Squad? I mean...seriously?
John: Bad first impression, but I'll give it some time. At least the guys involved might have talent.
Matt: I wouldn't be so pissed if there weren't actually talented people in the group who are going to have their career absolutely murdered by this gimmick.
John: It's cheap heel heat. Not a big deal. Not yet anyway.
John: RVD vs. Carlito at Mania? Think it happens?
Matt: If Carlito doesn't face Shaq, I think so. I'd rather have RVD in the Money in the Bank match, if it happens.
John: Shaq is playing basketball in New Jersey on WrestleMania night. Of course some idiots will still think he's wrestling at Mania. Let's just go further. Shaq vs. Bret Hart with Sammartino as ref. How about that?
Matt: Sweetness!
John: Note to those that don't understand sarcasm. That was a joke. It's not happening!
Matt: True or False. Matt Hardy will still be employed at the end of the year.
John: False. He'll ask to be released.
Matt: I say False as well. He'll be fired, and he'll start another Internet crusade. Nobody will care this time.
John: Is TNA going to get a new timeslot on Spike TV?
Matt: Yeah. Monday from 8-9. It's the best spot.
John: I think so. They're talking about Thursday nights as a lead in to the new Ultimate Fighter season in the spring. I can dig that. Sucka.
Thoughts? Questions? Comments. Email us at the addresses below or feel free to talk about it with us in the column feedback section of our forums. Also, if you've got an idea for a topic that we can use please let us know and we might use it.
The next edition of For Love or Money will come whenever we get the chance for it. Definitely will be before WrestleMania, though. Since we don't have a schedule for this stuff it could be late February, or later in March. We'll see.
Visit the For Love or Money Archives for the previous fourteen editions. Thanks for reading.
Matt "The Love" Seagull - OratorBirdman@gmail.com
John "JC Money" C. - oratoryjohn@gmail.com
