* The following interview with the Honky Tonk Man was conducted last Saturday in Switzerland by Sascha Wehinger and Daniel "muri" Maurer from genickbruch.com
muri for genickbruch.com: Is this the first time you are in Switzerland? And how do you like it so far?
Honky Tonk Man: Yes. First time and although I haven't seen a lot of it, what I have seen from the hotel and from outside here in Wil is beautiful. This time a year is the time you want to come here and see everyone is walking and biking. It very much ressembles where my wife is from and where I live, Calgary, Alberta, Canada. It is similar to a place called Powell where it is open for skiing all over the years and where the Winter Olympics where a few years ago. So I when I tell her, I was gonna get a picture today, but I just let her check the website, the Wil website or the Switzerland website. It is so much easier to look at websites now or the National Geographics than it is for me to take photos, but I am going to tell her that the weather is very similar to Alberta, the mountains in Alberta and when you look across the horizon, you can see the snow capped mountains which is very similar to the mountains in Canada.
muri for genickbruch.com: Are you going to fly back right after the show?
Honky Tonk Man: I go back tomorrow morning, I leave in the morning. I got a flight back then and I fly 11 hours to Dallas, 2 hours to Arizona, so something like a 20 hour day tomorrow for me to be home. Normal. But I don't mind, I enjoy these trips and I am glad we put it together. It came about off the internet, off the website. The people, that put this event together, they did not speak to me on the phone, it was all done by internet.
muri for genickbruch.com: What do you expect from tonight's event?
Honky Tonk Man: I really hope that it's going to be a good crowd, maybe an exiting crowd here in Wil, that gets into the matches. They got some really good wrestlers here, I worked out with a few of them over the last couple of nights in some seminars. I am glad to have a group of wrestlers here, because I don't think there is any other wrestling here in Switzerland than this SWF.
muri for genickbruch.com: That's right! How did you prepare for the match tonight? Do you even know your opponent or is it just a name on the paper?
Honky Tonk Man: No, I don't know a lot about him, but that's what is interesting about what I am doing, what we call Independent Wrestling where I go to places all around the world, whether it'll be England or Scotland, where I go next month. I go to Canada or all across America, where you have always different types, different wrestlers, different personas that they try to portray. It test my ability to see if I am up to part my training that I did a few years ago, if I can keep up and do the things they do. I enjoy the challenge of meeting the new guys and new styles.
muri for genickbruch.com: You gave wrestling lessons this afternoon I guess. What did you teach them? Basic moves or do you have a special kind of training?
Honky Tonk Man: A little bit of both. We went some of the basics, but most of them they already know and they have adapted to it very well. I talked a little bit of psychology of how to put a match together, so it is not all scrambled eggs. That it makes a story, so the match is like a book, where it's each chapter telling a story that leads to the next chapter and that's eventually leads to the ending and those things. It's hard for the young guys to get that, they don't get it right away. It takes some few years, but if someone like myself comes in and I tell them the same things that their trainer was telling them, now they have to start going "my god, they must have been right". Sometimes students don't listen to their teacher, but if someone else's coming in and says the same things that the teacher say than they go "OK, maybe they're right."
muri for genickbruch.com: Is the show part of the training? I mean, you have a lot of show in your entrance and in the ring...
Honky Tonk Man: Yeah, we talked about that, how you carry yourself when you go to the ring, when you're in the ring, your presentation. Because, what I told them, is: "You are the product. You are selling a product and the product is you. You have to sell your goods and your services which is you to the people, to make the people buy your product and the product is you.
muri for genickbruch.com: If you look at all these young people in the wrestling business today, is there a person or a wrestler that you know, where we should keep an eye on? A real talent, where you think that he can make or has it already made?
Honky Tonk Man: I see a few. I do 60, 70 shows a year for more than 20 promotions. So we are talking about a 1000 different wrestlers I see in a year. I see 1, 2 or 3 out of a 1000 that probably have a chance, that really have a chance. They're either too small or too tall and lanky with no bodies, they are not trained properly or they just have no idea about the business. There's a lot of people that can drive a truck, but there's some people, who are expert truck drivers. Not everyone can be the expert. So I don't see a lot. There's a couple of guys that I see out here working out in this organisation, that stand a chance. It is a number of getting it? It takes hunderts of thousands of wrestlers, to get 25 good ones, so that sets the number down.
muri for genickbruch.com: Is there any name that is already in the WWE that you knew he is going to make it? Someone you met earlier and you said, this guy is good?
Honky Tonk Man: Yeah, Rico. I wrestled Rico before he went to Ohio Valley. I saw him, I wrestled him in California. I told his trainer and I told him that this kid is really good. So I tried to get in touch with him to get him in touch with Jimmy Hart to send him to WCW, where he would have gotten a really good, lucrative contract and they would have used him properly right away. But instead he signed a very short contract, short money contract to go to Ohio Valley as a trainee where WWE kept him for 3 or 4 years. He was ready to go within 6 months and not 3 or 4 years of training in Ohio Valley. But he is now since come out as a pretty good talent. The first time I saw this kid Rocky, I knew right away. I knew right away, he had everything. He had the size, he had the look, he can wrestle and he can talk. I mean he's at a size of 6' 2" or 6' 3", he can wrestle small guys, he can wrestle giants, he had the body, he had the look. He appealed to white people, he appealed to black people, he appealed to polynesian people, because he has all that blood in him. So that's to say this is the guy that had it all, that's him. Very much like Hogan, Hogan had that big body, that golden taint, he can talk, he was believable, those people are hard to find. They are like once in every 10 years you find those guys. There's 2 guys now I wrestle periodically on the indepentend scene, that I have watched over the last 6 or 7 years, Johnny Swinger and Simon Diamond over the TNA, that I think that deserve a chance in the WWE, but for some reasons they just don't want to give those kids a chance. Maybe because I say they need a chance, maybe I should not say that. They are good hard, solid talents that I see can contribute. Same as I saw in Chris Benoit many years ago when Chris trained in Calgary and started up there in Calgary just before I went to WWE. He had the tools. Perry Saturn was another one that I saw. When I went to Killer Kowalski and I wrestled for Killer Kowalski, who was training Perry Saturn and Jean Paul Levesque which is Hunter Hearst, Triple H. I saw those 2 guys and I knew that they have the ability to make it. Both of them have.
muri for genickbruch.com: Do you follow the WWE programm?
Honky Tonk Man: I read the reports on the internet, I do not watch. I just don't sit down and watch wrestling shows anymore.
muri for genickbruch.com: If you were a booker, if you had unlimited control over WWE, would you change? Would you do something special?
Honky Tonk Man: Yeah, I would fire about half of them there. I would get rid off Flair, Arn Anderson, Fit Finlay. I would get rid off all that junk they got hanging around there. I would get rid off Hebner, Eric Bischoff. First of all I would have never hired a group of guys that came from a company that was going bancrupt or that was going to close because that group of guys could not keep the company afloat. They obviousely couldn't to the things they needed to do to make the business work. I would not have hired them, I would have been better off to find the Johnny Swinger's, the Simon Diamond's, newer, fresh talent, that you can spend 3 or 4 years building as opposed to taking these guys, who already destroyed a company that no one was watching. No one was watching WCW in it's final 6 months. No one was watching Ric Flair, no one was watching Eric Bischoff, no one was watching Arn Anderson and all those people. They just weren't watching them. I would have taken out of that company Chris Benoit, Perry Saturn, Dean Malenko, because I think he is really talented, even if he is not wrestling, I would have taken some of those guys, I would have taken Booker T, the others: No! Because no one was watching them, no one was buying that product. So why would me take it and guess what, I think I can make a buy. Well, good luck. And so far, they haven't bought. And they are still not buying.
muri for genickbruch.com: WWE is going back to gimmick wrestling lately. They have some new characters, they have some new gimmicks. What do you think of that? Would that be a chance to go back to WWE for the Honky Tonk Man?
Honky Tonk Man: Well, never say never. You know, if the phone rings and the situation is right, then I would go in and would probably not make a contribution for long term, but for short term. I could have contributed to ECW before they closed on short term. That particular company would never pursue talent that left WWE and bring them in. In short term I say 6 - 8 weeks capacity, where for 6 - 8 weeks it's a programm and at the end of the programm their local guy is the winner and the star moves on. The same is happen with TNA. The TNA people will bring the stars in. They brought the Road Warriors in, they kept them for one show, the brought Duggan in for 1 or 2 shows, they brought Bagwell in for 1 or 2 shows and said "We want to change your name to Marcus Alexander Bagwell." - Well he's got a name as Buff Bagwell, not Marcus Alexander is Bagwell anymore. When you do things like that, it doesn't make any sense. If I was booking WWE, I would definitely get rid off most of the girls. Girl Wrestling. There is nothing against Girl Wrestling, but you don't need them on TV every week. If you gonna have Girl Wrestlers on there, they should wrestle like girls, not like guys.
muri for genickbruch.com: Is there any chance for a guy in Switzerland to make a career in America? Or does he has to move to America and go to school there?
Honky Tonk Man: He would probably, unless he is very talented and has some years of experience, where he can go right in and start and make an impact, he wouldn't have to do that. But the way they do business now, he would probably have to go to America, go to one of those trainings schools and stay there until they decide "Let's try this guy.". What's the boys name from Sweden? Tony Halme. Ludvig Borga. OK, so they found him, they brought him in without have him go to the training school. They found the one kid from Australia, brought him in. I guess the best way to leave WWE is to get a ticket to Australia and never come back. There's been cases where guys have picked up that way, it is not too often. Because the older, talented guys that have been around, that have experience, they already looked at them and tried them. Now you pretty much have to go through that packing order of the wrestling school, that I see doesn't turn out a lot of people. If you look at the percentage over a period of the last five years, they have not turned out many wrestlers. Dr. Tom Pritchard had a wrestling school in Stanford, Connecticut. Actually a WWE school, but he did not turn out anyone. He had one german chap there, that he tried to put out on TV. Really muscular guy Bracchus. That was his project.
muri for genickbruch.com: Where is he now?
Honky Tonk Man: Phhh. Who knows...
muri for genickbruch.com: What do you think the roster split 2 years ago, SmackDown one brand, RAW the other brand. Do you think it's good or was it a big mistake, if you look for example at the ratings?
Honky Tonk Man: It was a good idea, but a mistake. It's like winning the battle but losing the war. They won the battle of... What happened was when you had 2 different TV stations, each station wants a different product. They want a different look, as far as the background, as far as the entrance, as far as the color of the ring. And they also want different wrestlers. If I am running the big station here in Switzerland and you are running the smaller station, and you want wrestling and they want wrestling. If they buy one show, and you say: "OK I wanna buy a show but I don't want to buy the same show they are buying, I want to buy a different show." And that's what they had to do, they had to sell a different show to a another station. They had to separate the people, because if the Zurich station is buying Rocky and Stone Cold and all the big stars, will you say, that you want some stars also. So they got to split them and put them into different sets. So that's why that happened. That's winning the battle, but losing the war. The war then became - what you said - the ratings falling. So consequently they got to do talent-roster switching. This doesn't work. Because in reality both shows looked the same. The only difference is the entrance and the color. One is blue, one is red and black or something. One has this pyro going this way, one has the pyro going the other way. But then when you switch and say "OK, these guys are going be dragged over here, and those over there", this doesn't change your viewership. There is only so many people that watch wrestling. They're either watching it on a Monday night or Thursday night. They don't watch both nights of the week. They usually have something else to do.
muri for genickbruch.com: I do, when I am in the States, I do.
Honky Tonk Man: You watch both nights. See, some people do watch both nights. You are one of the World Wrestling Fans. The typical wrestling fan will not watch four hours of wrestling a week. They just won't. Maybe two hours, maybe one hour over here and over here. Because people have other things to do. I knew it wouldn't work with the split.
muri for genickbruch.com: Did you tell them?
Honky Tonk Man: No. I mean, I put it on my website that it will not work. Simply because, there again, they did not have the talent to support 2 shows. They have a lot of people, a lot of bodies, but bodies do not make ratings. You have to have a certain level of talent that can support those 2 shows. They had a lot of bodies, so that's why they did it. "We have enough people, we can do it." OK fine, now once the ratings start to fall and TV executives started to say: "Now wait a minute, we're not getting the talent they get over here that they are getting over here.". It is a lack of talent. And they feel it and they see it and they know it.
muri for genickbruch.com: When will it gonna end?
Honky Tonk Man: Who knows. I don't know, I can't see it. I just don't see a saviour. I don't see a Rocky, or Austin, or Kurt Angle was very, very good and they made a lot of joke out of him and made a goofy charakter of him. Which I thought here is a real, solid, good charakter heel and people hated. Then Brock Lesnar was a failure, which I said on my website, that this guy is not going to carry the company. I don't see anyone right now, a breakout charakter.
muri for genickbruch.com: What do you think about Eugene?
Honky Tonk Man: This is something they're doing. I know the original Eugene, he was the kid of a local referee in Pittsburgh all around Pennsylvania and the kid was named Eugene and he was mentally challenged. They did not create something new, they just took one kid of Pennsylvania with the name Eugene and gave them this name. I am not sure if the original Eugene might be flattered about it or maybe not.
muri for genickbruch.com: There is one match situation I know you from and that was the Ultimate Warrior Squash. How you feel about that?
Honky Tonk Man: I get asked that question a lot. It was the best way for both, he and I, to salvage ourselves. I say salvage ourselves as me being the 15 month champion. It was the best way for me to continue on with that legacy of being the 15 month champion, losing very quickly to someone out of the blue. As opposed to me taking and going in to a 15 or 20 minute match, that would have looked bad for both he and I. It would have done nothing for me, it would have done nothing for him. He was the one that needed to be pushed to the next level. My level wasn't going up, my level was gonna be where it was and go down. Because I have already had my spot and once they take the spot, they don't give it back to you until later on or maybe never. I knew the plans they had for him where at a higher level and for him to even come close to be on my level, he needed to destroy me right away. Which gave him the legitimacy of being championship material. He just killed the guy who's had the belt for 15 month. This guy is a monster. So it put him, it did more for his career than it did for mine, in terms of catapulting him. And at that point, this was my job. My job was to move this kid up. And I did that. In the same thing not to destroy myself. A 20 minute match with the Warrior, I think you would have turned the TV off. You would have said, that the Honky Tonk Man is finished, he's washed up, he's horrible, but the Warrior is worse than him. And if the Warrior would have won the match after 20 minutes, it would not have put him even equal to me. You would have still said he is a warrior, but he is not good.
muri for genickbruch.com: When you heard the decision the first time, that you are going to lose him after 13 seconds, how did you react?
Honky Tonk Man: Well, that was my call. That was all my decision.
muri for genickbruch.com: You couldn't do anything? I would have said: "You are crazy, I have not worked 15 months for this and now you are destroying my gimmick.".
Honky Tonk Man: That's what we did. We had about 5 months of return matches with him. And you guys might not have seen it, but these were the interviews we did: "For 15 months I am the Greatest Intercontinental Champion of all time, you were not signed for this match, you did not have a contract for this match, you don't deserve that belt and this belt is still mine and I am going to get it back!" Technically, now technically, since it was not a signed and sanctioned match by Gorilla Monsoon and or not Gorilla Monsoon, it was Jack Tuney at that time, technically since that match was not signed and sanctioned, I am still the champion there. So anyway, these were the interviews we did: "In 15 months, I beat everybody and no one has been able to beat me. And here you run out the locker room and you run out there and in 13 seconds you got the belt. You've got my belt and I want my belt back!" - So I am like the whining cry baby that has just lost his toy. So that's what we did. And then for the next 5 months he beat me, defeated me in longer matches, we had 7 - 10 minutes matches. Then he went on to Ravishing Rick Rude, who put together 20 minutes matches with him. Rick Rude kind of trained him and promoted him to get him ready for Hogan, so they can have that 20 - 30 minutes match with Hogan, and it came up pretty good.
muri for genickbruch.com: I have a few pop up questions, where I just tell you one word or name and you say what pops up first in your mind.
Honky Tonk Man: Like "Eric Bischoff" - "Asshole".
muri for genickbruch.com: Yeah, like that. Switzerland?
Honky Tonk Man: Beautiful Place.
muri for genickbruch.com: SWF?
Honky Tonk Man: Nice company, I like it.
muri for genickbruch.com: WWE?
Honky Tonk Man: Pay checks never bounce.
muri for genickbruch.com: ECW?
Honky Tonk Man: Good at the time, they ruined their business.
muri for genickbruch.com: Wrestlemania?
Honky Tonk Man: Big event.
muri for genickbruch.com: Ultimate Warrior?
Honky Tonk Man: Maybe not a deserving push.
muri for genickbruch.com: Jesse Ventura?
Honky Tonk Man: Good guy.
muri for genickbruch.com: Mick Foley?
Honky Tonk Man: He is full of shit, but he is a good guy.
muri for genickbruch.com: Owen Hart and the whole Hart Family?
Honky Tonk Man: Owen was the most likeable of all Hart Brothers in the family. They are unikely different very unique, I am glad I knew him.
muri for genickbruch.com: Jimmy Hart?
Honky Tonk Man: The hardest working guy in the wrestling business.
muri for genickbruch.com: Jeff Hardy?
Honky Tonk Man: Suicidal with his stuff.
muri for genickbruch.com: Second run of Brian Christopher in the WWE?
Honky Tonk Man: The apple doesn't fall far from the tree. Like father like son. A fuck up.
muri for genickbruch.com: What I do if I don't wrestle?
Honky Tonk Man: Ease off.
muri for genickbruch.com: Internet?
Honky Tonk Man: Great for everything. Communication and information is the key.
muri for genickbruch.com: Influence of Wrestling in my private life?
Honky Tonk Man: Not much.
muri for genickbruch.com: So you are just the Honky Tonk Man when...
Honky Tonk Man: ... when I dressed up. I am able to separate the man from the gimmick. Some people can't do that. Some people live the gimmick, I don't. I don't shave, I don't fix my hair. I don't dry my hair. I don't walk around my house with my suits on. I don't dress up with my robe in the airplane like Ric Flair and "Whoooo". I guess I am able to separate. I don't know why someone would dress up in a robe on the airplane and step down the aisle going "Whoooo". I just don't know. What an ignorant son of a bitch. I hope you print that!
muri for genickbruch.com: Yeah I will. Wrestling Books?
Honky Tonk Man: None of them are true.
muri for genickbruch.com: Have you read any? Have you read them all?
Honky Tonk Man: No, never read one of them. I have read the first chapter of Arn Anderson's book. He mentioned him starting in the business and having his first match with Bob Armstrong in Alabama TV. He did not mention he had it to pay on his own. When he went down, Bob Armstrong came to him to get it paid all. So since he did not mention that, I feel like he did not want anybody to know that, so I probably thought the whole book is going to be a lie.
muri for genickbruch.com: Shoot Interviews?
Honky Tonk Man: I like them. I like doing them. I have not heard any, but the ones I've done. The ones I have done have been OK from what I've understand from the reports I heard. I heard Road Warrior Hawk - God bless him - had a great one. I heard Dusty Rhodes had a "it was supposed to be shoot but it wasn't" - one. I heard Bill Watts had a pretty good one too. Guys tend to be political correct sometimes on the shoot interviews, when they should go ahead and just do a shoot. But they are afraid, that it gets printed and they can't back it up with facts, that they get sued. Lawsueds are big in our country for deformation and for things like that. So you better have facts and basis, because when I call someone an asshole, I better back it up with facts. I'd have to find more people that call him an asshole.
muri for genickbruch.com: George W. Bush?
Honky Tonk Man: Probably not going to be re-elected.
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